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Mazedonien vs Griechenland: Schiedsspruch am 5. Dezember

Erstellt von Zoran, 25.11.2011, 14:02 Uhr · 684 Antworten · 30.309 Aufrufe

  1. #671
    Avatar von Zoran

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    Macedonia Wins a Battle But Not the War in Name Dispute with Greece


    A historic day for Macedonia, a bitter defeat for Greece. That is how Macedonian media reported euphorically about the judgement of the International Court of Justice in the Hague from December 5, stipulating that Greece has breached the 1995 interim agreement with Skopje by blocking the country's admission to NATO at the summit of the alliance in April 2008.
    With 15 votes "for" and only one "against" the court concluded that Greece had violated article 11, paragraph 1 from the arrangement, that says that the country agrees not to object Skopje's admission to international or regional organisations and institutions whose member it is. Greece has reserved the right, though, to object to any membership of Skopje if the country is to be referred under a name different than Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia.
    Athens and Skopje are at loggerheads over the name of Macedonia for two decades. Greece believes that Macedonia's constitutional name implies territorial pretences to its northern province with the same name.
    Macedonian President Gjorge Ivanov called on Greeks to comply with the court's ruling that was final and mandatory for all UN members. "At this moment we don't want to think in categories winners and losers. We should work together with Greece for the sake of our common future and the future of the region. We are reaching out to Greece in the name of good neighbourly relations and friendship. We consider this ruling a positive impetus," he said.
    Greece, on its part, said that it would study the court's ruling and added that the two sides would continue searching for a solution to the dispute. Greek Prime Minister Lucas Papademos said that Greece was committed to good neighbourly relations with Skopje but was also calling for finding a mutually acceptable solution.
    The ruling of the court in The Hague could have a moral value and make Macedonians feel like winners but actually it does not oblige third parties, like NATO or the EU, to give a green light to Macedonian membership application. A compromise and more flexibility between the two sides are needed in order to find a solution to the problem.
    As pointed out in an editorial in the Dnevnik daily from December 6, the ruling is not "a ticket for immediate entry to NATO" and Macedonia needs to focus on the strategy - what after The Hague. Utrinski Vesnik daily added: "The ruling, that has a big legal and moral weight, should not be used to gain political points at domestic level and straining further the relations with Greece".
    A similar view was shared by EP Rapporteur on Macedonia Richard Howitt, who told Deutsche Welle that the ICJ's ruling should give new impetus to the talks and lead eventually to a mutually acceptable solution. The European Commission said it would take note of the ruling but declined to comment. Macedonia is still hoping to get a green-light for opening of its EU accession talks at the EU summit on December 8 and 9 and not just another confirmation of the recommendation.
    In the October 12 progress report on Macedonia the Commission said that the country continued to meet political criteria and was ready to start accession talks.
    The document urges for more efforts in order to guarantee effective implementation of judicial and administrative reform, fight against corruption and freedom of expression in the media. Dialogue between the government and the opposition needs to be strengthened in order to ensure the smooth functioning of institutions and to allow Parliament to play its full role, the report reads.
    The European Commission did not miss to note that the name dispute was affecting the relations between the two neighbours and recalled Skopje's decision to erect a monument resembling Alexander the Great, which was slammed as provocation by Athens. "Actions and statements, which could adversely affect good neighbourly relations should be avoided," the Commission recommended.
    Macedonia was granted a recommendation to start membership talks in 2009 but the name dispute is still impending over its European and Euro-Atlantic ambitions. One should not forget that the decisions at the EU leaders' summit require consensus and that good neighbourly relations are among the criteria which fulfilling could bring positive outcome for Macedonia.

    Macedonia Wins a Battle But Not the War in Name Dispute with Greece

  2. #672
    Yunan
    Zitat Zitat von Zoran Beitrag anzeigen
    Das offizielle Athen hat sich einen bulgarischen Europa Parlamentarier als neues Feindobjekt ausgesucht.



    http://www.kanal5.com.mk/default.asp...&eventId=84129
    Kanal 5, das balkanische CNN behauptet, du glaubst.

    Zitat Zitat von Zoran Beitrag anzeigen
    Komiti FK Vardar

    Ви благодариме! Ако македонскиот?

    Kommt der hier mit einem Drittliga-Spiel und bildet sich was drauf ein.

  3. #673
    Avatar von Zoran

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    Zitat Zitat von Yunan Beitrag anzeigen
    Kanal 5, das balkanische CNN behauptet, du glaubst.



    Ви благодариме! Ако македонскиот?

    Kommt der hier mit einem Drittliga-Spiel und bildet sich was drauf ein.

    Die mazedonischen Medien haben lediglich ihre bulgarischen Kollegen zitiert.

    Bulgarian MEP Kristian Vigenin calls Greece to leave the door or Macedonia’s EU membership ajar - FOCUS Information Agency

  4. #674
    Yunan
    Entgegen den Erwartungen Mazedoniens forderte das Gericht Griechenland jedoch nicht auf, für die Zukunft eine mögliche Blockadehaltung aufzugeben, wenn Mazedonien weitere Mitgliedschaften bei anderen internationalen Organisationen beantrage.
    Uff, war wohl nix.

    Aber egal, einmal im Fernsehen sein ist auch mal was tolles.

    Zitat Zitat von Zoran Beitrag anzeigen
    Soll ich dir sagen, was die Bulgaren über euch denken?



    Oh, ihr Kinder des Zeus.

    FYROM is a Joke!

  5. #675
    Avatar von Zoran

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    Zitat Zitat von Yunan Beitrag anzeigen
    Uff, war wohl nix.

    Aber egal, einmal im Fernsehen sein ist auch mal was tolles.
    Ja kla, der Verlierer ist eigentlich der Gewinner

  6. #676
    Yunan
    Ne, ihr habt nichts gewonnen.

    Der IGH hat uns sogar noch den Rücken gestärkt, indem er bekräftigt, dass wir weiterhin das Recht haben, euch bzgl. EU und NATO zu blockieren.

    Textinterpretation ist wohl nicht so deine Stärke, was?

  7. #677
    Avatar von Zoran

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    Zitat Zitat von Yunan Beitrag anzeigen
    Ne, ihr habt nichts gewonnen.

    Der IGH hat uns sogar noch den Rücken gestärkt, indem er bekräftigt, dass wir weiterhin das Recht haben, euch bzgl. EU und NATO zu blockieren.

    Textinterpretation ist wohl nicht so deine Stärke, was?


    Ja kla, Griechenland ist der Gewinner.


  8. #678
    Dadi
    Aber mal Spaß bei Seite, für uns Jugos ist es das normalste der Welt "Makedonija" zu sagen. Historisches Geplänkel interessiert den Otto-Normal-'Jugo' nicht. Kann Griechen verstehen wenn sie das anskvörtet, wenn sich jemand mit vermeintlich "fremden" Federn schmückt, aber jbg, Leben ist kein Wunschkonzert. Verklagt sie doch einfach...

  9. #679
    Yunan
    Zitat Zitat von Zoran Beitrag anzeigen
    Ja kla, Griechenland ist der Gewinner.

    Hier stehts:

    Entgegen den Erwartungen Mazedoniens forderte das Gericht Griechenland jedoch nicht auf, für die Zukunft eine mögliche Blockadehaltung aufzugeben, wenn Mazedonien weitere Mitgliedschaften bei anderen internationalen Organisationen beantrage.
    Mazedonien: Uno tadelt Griechenland im Namensstreit - SPIEGEL ONLINE - Nachrichten - Politik

    Eure Erwartungen wurden nicht erfüllt und unser Rücken wurde gestärkt. Das ist ein Fakt.
    Ich bin gespannt, wie du das ganze jetzt wieder relativieren willst oder gar ignorierst.

  10. #680
    Avatar von Zoran

    Registriert seit
    10.08.2011
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    27.754
    Zitat Zitat von Yunan Beitrag anzeigen
    Hier stehts:



    Mazedonien: Uno tadelt Griechenland im Namensstreit - SPIEGEL ONLINE - Nachrichten - Politik

    Eure Erwartungen wurden nicht erfüllt und unser Rücken wurde gestärkt. Das ist ein Fakt.
    Ich bin gespannt, wie du das ganze jetzt wieder relativieren willst oder gar ignorierst.

    Ja kla, welches Gericht kann auch über das Stimmrecht verfügen??

    Aber da musst du erst aus deinen Pampers herauswachsen.


    Yunan das Medienopfer


    Greek Media Claim They Have Upper Hand in ICJ Ruling
    Thursday, 08 December 2011

    Much to my surprise, it took three days for Greek media to 'turn it around' and declare a win after they lost the ICJ ruling! Normally Athens needs few hours to take a loss, twist it around and make it a ‘win’.

    And what a win it was. Out of the five strong attorney team on the Greek side, only one stumbled into the Courtroom to hear the verdict. The rest didn't bother, already knew the outcome.

    Greek dailies Eleftherotypia and Ta Nea were strong proponents and base this "win" on the fact that the Court did not specifically state that Greece cannot veto Macedonia’s entrance into international organizations in the future. The Court also did not state Greece is forbidden to apply for more Bailout money, it even did not state each household must open an account with Goldman Sachs.
    The reason for this is simple: that's not what the lawsuit was about.

    You rarely see someone celebrate something that wasn't stated, but if someone will, it would be Greece's Government controlled media!

    In reality, the ICJ did not instruct Greece not to veto Macedonia again because it stated the interim accord (Agreement) itself has forbidden Greece to veto Macedonia!

    The ICJ didn’t say ‘you broke the Accord and you are welcome to veto again’ which is outside the realm of logic. They ICJ stated ‘Greece broke the Accord and the Accord explicitly states you cannot veto’ so there is no need for the ICJ to emphasize the obvious “don’t break Agreements you sign at the UN”.
    Someone with common sense in their posession will understand this.

    Understandably, Greece is nursing their pride after being embarrassed by a 15-1 vote. This also raises questions among European nations particularly (Sweden, Germany, Finland) who have aksed Greece to sign additional documents in order to get bailout money. However, the ICJ just showed these countries, Greece is not someone you can trust, even when they do sign official Agreements. This would explain why Finland is hand picking Greek islands in order to lend money.

    Perhaps it is a good thing to think like the Greek media.
    I just wished the Macedonian Football Federation used Greek logic for once and tells us: Macedonia lost 2-0, however this is less than the previous loss of 5-1, therefore it is a WIN for us. But, they can't tell us such thing, they know we are smarter than that.



    http://macedoniaonline.eu/content/view/19788/2/

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